insteon interface options - Hub 2?

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insteon interface options - Hub 2?

peter-469
Greetings all,

I have a usb PLM 2413UH that has been flaky for some time so I am looking for an
alternative.

I purchased a Hub 2 2245-222 after a hurried check to verify compatibility. My
checks were apparently inadequate as further research after the fact suggests that
it is probably not a viable alternative. I tried to telnet to the Hub IP at port
9761 and get a could not open port msg. The hub does respond to ping. Is there any
one out there that has found a way to use the Hub 2 as a substitute for a PLM? I
would rather not purchase another 2413UH as they are, in my opinion, overpriced,
less reliable than they ought to be and don't have an ethernet interface. I also
don't want to purchase a 'solution' that is no longer in production such as the
refurb hubs.

Thanks for taking the time to read and (I hope) respond.

Peter

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Re: insteon interface options - Hub 2?

Wayne Gatlin

I have the INSTEON 2242-222 Hub and it works pretty good.  Have you tried doing a port scan to see if they just changed the port number?  Or maybe there's an option to enable it in the app or Web interface.  I hope they aren't moving away from having the low level tcp interface in the new models,  that would mean we would need to possibly write new code to use the Web api.

On Dec 5, 2014 10:50 PM, "peter" <[hidden email]> wrote:
Greetings all,

I have a usb PLM 2413UH that has been flaky for some time so I am looking for an
alternative.

I purchased a Hub 2 2245-222 after a hurried check to verify compatibility. My
checks were apparently inadequate as further research after the fact suggests that
it is probably not a viable alternative. I tried to telnet to the Hub IP at port
9761 and get a could not open port msg. The hub does respond to ping. Is there any
one out there that has found a way to use the Hub 2 as a substitute for a PLM? I
would rather not purchase another 2413UH as they are, in my opinion, overpriced,
less reliable than they ought to be and don't have an ethernet interface. I also
don't want to purchase a 'solution' that is no longer in production such as the
refurb hubs.

Thanks for taking the time to read and (I hope) respond.

Peter

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Re: insteon interface options - Hub 2?

krkeegan
Administrator
The reports I have seen on the Hub II (2245-222 I believe) indicate that it no loner has the "PLM" feature inside of it.  So it may not work with MH.

But given the comparatively cheap price of $40, I have ordered one to tinker with.

Rambling Thoughts:
I have been toying with the idea of creating a separate Insteon Interface that exposes a standardized API for the hubs.  Leave the link management and device configuration to the hub but abstract and standardize an interface for controlling Insteon devices.

Home automation is getting more fragmented.  There is a need for a good central aggregation platform.  MH might be able to fill that role.

Coding our own custom support for each protocol entirely in-house is a monstrous task.  The hundreds of hours of Insteon coding in MH can only ever be used by MH.  I suspect that we might find more coding assistance and interest if we abstracted the Insteon support into a standalone project that other aggregating platforms could also use.  

Again, just random thoughts.

On Tue, Dec 9, 2014 at 10:36 AM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]> wrote:

I have the INSTEON 2242-222 Hub and it works pretty good.  Have you tried doing a port scan to see if they just changed the port number?  Or maybe there's an option to enable it in the app or Web interface.  I hope they aren't moving away from having the low level tcp interface in the new models,  that would mean we would need to possibly write new code to use the Web api.

On Dec 5, 2014 10:50 PM, "peter" <[hidden email]> wrote:
Greetings all,

I have a usb PLM 2413UH that has been flaky for some time so I am looking for an
alternative.

I purchased a Hub 2 2245-222 after a hurried check to verify compatibility. My
checks were apparently inadequate as further research after the fact suggests that
it is probably not a viable alternative. I tried to telnet to the Hub IP at port
9761 and get a could not open port msg. The hub does respond to ping. Is there any
one out there that has found a way to use the Hub 2 as a substitute for a PLM? I
would rather not purchase another 2413UH as they are, in my opinion, overpriced,
less reliable than they ought to be and don't have an ethernet interface. I also
don't want to purchase a 'solution' that is no longer in production such as the
refurb hubs.

Thanks for taking the time to read and (I hope) respond.

Peter

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Re: insteon interface options - Hub 2?

Wayne Gatlin
Sorry for the very late response, my new baby girl (7 days old) had to
be admitted to the hospital, so I've been there all week.

Kevin,

I agree, I've been thinking about the hub web API instead of the raw
Insteon protocol and that would push individual Insteon device support
back to the HUB. This also may allow for devices/scenes to be added
via misterhouse and then automatically discovered by the Insteon
Android app, so you don't have to add them in both places. The only
down side I see to using the web API is that we will probably lose
some of the the features like fast on and broadcast.


Peter,

I agree, removing the direct Insteon interface makes no sense. The
biggest issue I find with most everything I purchase is that the
manufacturer tries to force you to use their products exclusively,
they way they want you to use them. I especially hate when you are
forced to use a "cloud" service outside of your home network, I do not
want to rely on my home internet service to be able to turn my lights
on...

The external site you are referring to, is just another way to control
the devices connected to the HUB, I'm not sure exactly what else it
does but I'll do some network captures this week and see. I know the
Android app connects direct to the HUB (as would MH), it does not rely
on the external site to send commands to Insteon devices.


If you still want to do the scans, you can use nmap:

nmap 192.168.1.30 -p 1-65535 --open

Starting Nmap 6.40 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2014-12-12 10:54 CST
Nmap scan report for 192.168.195.30
Host is up (0.0043s latency).
Not shown: 10 filtered ports
PORT     STATE SERVICE
80/tcp   open  http
9761/tcp open  unknown
MAC Address: 00:0E:F3:26:15:30 (Smarthome)


Only 1 connection to the Insteon interface port is allowed, so make
sure nothing else is connecting to it. If you find another port open
other then the web interface, maybe you can configure it in MH and see
if its the correct one.


-Wayne


On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 12:36 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> The reports I have seen on the Hub II (2245-222 I believe) indicate that it
> no loner has the "PLM" feature inside of it.  So it may not work with MH.
>
> But given the comparatively cheap price of $40, I have ordered one to tinker
> with.
>
> Rambling Thoughts:
> I have been toying with the idea of creating a separate Insteon Interface
> that exposes a standardized API for the hubs.  Leave the link management and
> device configuration to the hub but abstract and standardize an interface
> for controlling Insteon devices.
>
> Home automation is getting more fragmented.  There is a need for a good
> central aggregation platform.  MH might be able to fill that role.
>
> Coding our own custom support for each protocol entirely in-house is a
> monstrous task.  The hundreds of hours of Insteon coding in MH can only ever
> be used by MH.  I suspect that we might find more coding assistance and
> interest if we abstracted the Insteon support into a standalone project that
> other aggregating platforms could also use.
>
> Again, just random thoughts.
>
> On Tue, Dec 9, 2014 at 10:36 AM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> I have the INSTEON 2242-222 Hub and it works pretty good.  Have you tried
>> doing a port scan to see if they just changed the port number?  Or maybe
>> there's an option to enable it in the app or Web interface.  I hope they
>> aren't moving away from having the low level tcp interface in the new
>> models,  that would mean we would need to possibly write new code to use the
>> Web api.
>>
>> On Dec 5, 2014 10:50 PM, "peter" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Greetings all,
>>>
>>> I have a usb PLM 2413UH that has been flaky for some time so I am looking
>>> for an
>>> alternative.
>>>
>>> I purchased a Hub 2 2245-222 after a hurried check to verify
>>> compatibility. My
>>> checks were apparently inadequate as further research after the fact
>>> suggests that
>>> it is probably not a viable alternative. I tried to telnet to the Hub IP
>>> at port
>>> 9761 and get a could not open port msg. The hub does respond to ping. Is
>>> there any
>>> one out there that has found a way to use the Hub 2 as a substitute for a
>>> PLM? I
>>> would rather not purchase another 2413UH as they are, in my opinion,
>>> overpriced,
>>> less reliable than they ought to be and don't have an ethernet interface.
>>> I also
>>> don't want to purchase a 'solution' that is no longer in production such
>>> as the
>>> refurb hubs.
>>>
>>> Thanks for taking the time to read and (I hope) respond.
>>>
>>> Peter
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
>>>
>>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>>> ________________________________________________________
>>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
>>
>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>> ________________________________________________________
>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>
>>
>

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Re: insteon interface options - Hub 2?

peter-469
Thanks for your comments Wayne.

As far our remarks regarding the external site go, Wouldn't that depend at least on whether or not you are connecting via LAN vs WAN? I know nothing about the way the Hub II works in terms of where and how the code lives and works. For a WAN connection, I would expect this to start with the app initially connecting to the insteon authentication portal which will provide redirection information (a handoff) after authentication. This would require regular checkins by Hub II to keep WAN IP up to date (unless Hub can check the WAN IP on it's own). Having the Hub keep track would seem best but this is all speculation on my part. As I think about it, there would need to be some keys exchanged to secure the process after handoff etc. as well.

I assume that the nmap example was not on a Hub II correct? I will be happy to do the scan and publish the results - if possible I will post them tonight. Esp if it is not duplication of effort.

At the moment I do not have MH up and running so I would rather rely on a simpler faster method of testing what can be done with any open ports found.   I have been toying with MH on recycled desktops but that has turned out to be less reliable and more complicated to implement than I want to count on for anything more than curiosity. Most recently, I have had issues with intermittent 2413 USB interface that killed progress. I purchased the HUB II and a BeagleBone last month in hopes of getting a reliable platform for MH that I could afford to have spares on hand for in case of failure. I also dont' like the lack of a positive retention feature on USB which is yet another reason to avoid another 2413U.

I was planning on working to get the BBB running MH this weekend depending on 'chores',etc. Even if I get it done, I would be less than confident using it for testing the Hub II but perhaps setup will go smoothly and I will find a port worth poking at! Would still prefer to use terminal and 'poke' that way though...

Regards,

Peter

On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 12:38 PM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]> wrote:
Sorry for the very late response, my new baby girl (7 days old) had to
be admitted to the hospital, so I've been there all week.

Kevin,

I agree, I've been thinking about the hub web API instead of the raw
Insteon protocol and that would push individual Insteon device support
back to the HUB. This also may allow for devices/scenes to be added
via misterhouse and then automatically discovered by the Insteon
Android app, so you don't have to add them in both places. The only
down side I see to using the web API is that we will probably lose
some of the the features like fast on and broadcast.


Peter,

I agree, removing the direct Insteon interface makes no sense. The
biggest issue I find with most everything I purchase is that the
manufacturer tries to force you to use their products exclusively,
they way they want you to use them. I especially hate when you are
forced to use a "cloud" service outside of your home network, I do not
want to rely on my home internet service to be able to turn my lights
on...

The external site you are referring to, is just another way to control
the devices connected to the HUB, I'm not sure exactly what else it
does but I'll do some network captures this week and see. I know the
Android app connects direct to the HUB (as would MH), it does not rely
on the external site to send commands to Insteon devices.


If you still want to do the scans, you can use nmap:

nmap 192.168.1.30 -p 1-65535 --open

Starting Nmap 6.40 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2014-12-12 10:54 CST
Nmap scan report for 192.168.195.30
Host is up (0.0043s latency).
Not shown: 10 filtered ports
PORT     STATE SERVICE
80/tcp   open  http
9761/tcp open  unknown
MAC Address: 00:0E:F3:26:15:30 (Smarthome)


Only 1 connection to the Insteon interface port is allowed, so make
sure nothing else is connecting to it. If you find another port open
other then the web interface, maybe you can configure it in MH and see
if its the correct one.


-Wayne


On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 12:36 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> The reports I have seen on the Hub II (2245-222 I believe) indicate that it
> no loner has the "PLM" feature inside of it.  So it may not work with MH.
>
> But given the comparatively cheap price of $40, I have ordered one to tinker
> with.
>
> Rambling Thoughts:
> I have been toying with the idea of creating a separate Insteon Interface
> that exposes a standardized API for the hubs.  Leave the link management and
> device configuration to the hub but abstract and standardize an interface
> for controlling Insteon devices.
>
> Home automation is getting more fragmented.  There is a need for a good
> central aggregation platform.  MH might be able to fill that role.
>
> Coding our own custom support for each protocol entirely in-house is a
> monstrous task.  The hundreds of hours of Insteon coding in MH can only ever
> be used by MH.  I suspect that we might find more coding assistance and
> interest if we abstracted the Insteon support into a standalone project that
> other aggregating platforms could also use.
>
> Again, just random thoughts.
>
> On Tue, Dec 9, 2014 at 10:36 AM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> I have the INSTEON 2242-222 Hub and it works pretty good.  Have you tried
>> doing a port scan to see if they just changed the port number?  Or maybe
>> there's an option to enable it in the app or Web interface.  I hope they
>> aren't moving away from having the low level tcp interface in the new
>> models,  that would mean we would need to possibly write new code to use the
>> Web api.
>>
>> On Dec 5, 2014 10:50 PM, "peter" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Greetings all,
>>>
>>> I have a usb PLM 2413UH that has been flaky for some time so I am looking
>>> for an
>>> alternative.
>>>
>>> I purchased a Hub 2 2245-222 after a hurried check to verify
>>> compatibility. My
>>> checks were apparently inadequate as further research after the fact
>>> suggests that
>>> it is probably not a viable alternative. I tried to telnet to the Hub IP
>>> at port
>>> 9761 and get a could not open port msg. The hub does respond to ping. Is
>>> there any
>>> one out there that has found a way to use the Hub 2 as a substitute for a
>>> PLM? I
>>> would rather not purchase another 2413UH as they are, in my opinion,
>>> overpriced,
>>> less reliable than they ought to be and don't have an ethernet interface.
>>> I also
>>> don't want to purchase a 'solution' that is no longer in production such
>>> as the
>>> refurb hubs.
>>>
>>> Thanks for taking the time to read and (I hope) respond.
>>>
>>> Peter
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
>>>
>>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>>> ________________________________________________________
>>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
>>
>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>> ________________________________________________________
>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>
>>
>

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Re: insteon interface options - Hub 2?

krkeegan
Administrator
The Hub II is not looking good for MH.  The following is a lot of technical rambling.

I opened the device up.  Much of the weight are two steel bars added to make it seem more substantial.  Inside it has a PIC32MX695F512H microcontroller with 512K of flash and 128K of RAM.  So not much.

I ran NMAP:

Starting Nmap 6.40 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2014-12-12 18:32 PST
Nmap scan report for 192.168.100.203
Host is up (0.00074s latency).
Not shown: 65531 filtered ports
PORT      STATE SERVICE
23/tcp    open  telnet
443/tcp   open  https
992/tcp   open  telnets
25105/tcp open  unknown

The telnet port seems to be available for only a limited time after bootup.  It displays a demo screen for the microcontroller, somewhat interesting to look at, but best I can tell it doesn't do much.

I couldn't get into the SSL/telnet connection, but I imagine it is the same.

both the 443 and 25105 port are http servers that respond with the same simple page describing the details of the Hub and instructions on how to find the user manual and instructions to visit:


to control the hub.  

If you poke around you can also get to a MPFS Image Upload page.  This appears to allow uploading of new microcontroller binary files.  So there is an outside chance we could upload our own, but in doing so we would almost certainly break the original functionality of the hub since we would be wiping out the original binary image.


The connect website is seriously lacking in comparison to the iOS and Android apps.  Best I can tell it actually tries to communicate directly with your hub's local private IP address to issue commands, so the website (if it worked) would only be usable in your own house.  I see a career posting on Insteon's website for a web programmer, so maybe this is under development.

I did some packet sniffing of the hub.  It seems to connect and keep-alive SSL connections to connect.insteon.com and prod.insteon.pubnub.com.  If I had to guess, I would say that the messages from the Hub to the mobile devices go out across the pubnub connection and commands issued from the phone are sent to the insteon website.

I had hoped that given the diminutive nature of the device that it wouldn't verify the accuracy of SSL certificates.  I tried remapping these addresses to my own SSL server, but the device seemed to fail to complete the SSL handshake.  I did not try self-signing a certificate as one of the two services.  It is possible that the device doesn't have information on the root certificates.

The hub still seems to communicate using the same method described here:


For most purposes, the hub seems to simply act as a TCP PLM (almost quite literally, the simple webpage lists a separate firmware number for the PLM).  So the PLM electronics have likely just been adapted to interface with the microcontroller.  It looks like all of the logic is handled by the various mobile apps and perhaps the connect webservice.  I would guess that the hub simply receives prewritten insteon messages and transmits them.  This way the firmware doesn't need to be updated everytime a new device is added to the Insteon lineup.

On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:41 AM, Peter Whalley <[hidden email]> wrote:
Thanks for your comments Wayne.

As far our remarks regarding the external site go, Wouldn't that depend at least on whether or not you are connecting via LAN vs WAN? I know nothing about the way the Hub II works in terms of where and how the code lives and works. For a WAN connection, I would expect this to start with the app initially connecting to the insteon authentication portal which will provide redirection information (a handoff) after authentication. This would require regular checkins by Hub II to keep WAN IP up to date (unless Hub can check the WAN IP on it's own). Having the Hub keep track would seem best but this is all speculation on my part. As I think about it, there would need to be some keys exchanged to secure the process after handoff etc. as well.

I assume that the nmap example was not on a Hub II correct? I will be happy to do the scan and publish the results - if possible I will post them tonight. Esp if it is not duplication of effort.

At the moment I do not have MH up and running so I would rather rely on a simpler faster method of testing what can be done with any open ports found.   I have been toying with MH on recycled desktops but that has turned out to be less reliable and more complicated to implement than I want to count on for anything more than curiosity. Most recently, I have had issues with intermittent 2413 USB interface that killed progress. I purchased the HUB II and a BeagleBone last month in hopes of getting a reliable platform for MH that I could afford to have spares on hand for in case of failure. I also dont' like the lack of a positive retention feature on USB which is yet another reason to avoid another 2413U.

I was planning on working to get the BBB running MH this weekend depending on 'chores',etc. Even if I get it done, I would be less than confident using it for testing the Hub II but perhaps setup will go smoothly and I will find a port worth poking at! Would still prefer to use terminal and 'poke' that way though...

Regards,

Peter

On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 12:38 PM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]> wrote:
Sorry for the very late response, my new baby girl (7 days old) had to
be admitted to the hospital, so I've been there all week.

Kevin,

I agree, I've been thinking about the hub web API instead of the raw
Insteon protocol and that would push individual Insteon device support
back to the HUB. This also may allow for devices/scenes to be added
via misterhouse and then automatically discovered by the Insteon
Android app, so you don't have to add them in both places. The only
down side I see to using the web API is that we will probably lose
some of the the features like fast on and broadcast.


Peter,

I agree, removing the direct Insteon interface makes no sense. The
biggest issue I find with most everything I purchase is that the
manufacturer tries to force you to use their products exclusively,
they way they want you to use them. I especially hate when you are
forced to use a "cloud" service outside of your home network, I do not
want to rely on my home internet service to be able to turn my lights
on...

The external site you are referring to, is just another way to control
the devices connected to the HUB, I'm not sure exactly what else it
does but I'll do some network captures this week and see. I know the
Android app connects direct to the HUB (as would MH), it does not rely
on the external site to send commands to Insteon devices.


If you still want to do the scans, you can use nmap:

nmap 192.168.1.30 -p 1-65535 --open

Starting Nmap 6.40 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2014-12-12 10:54 CST
Nmap scan report for 192.168.195.30
Host is up (0.0043s latency).
Not shown: 10 filtered ports
PORT     STATE SERVICE
80/tcp   open  http
9761/tcp open  unknown
MAC Address: 00:0E:F3:26:15:30 (Smarthome)


Only 1 connection to the Insteon interface port is allowed, so make
sure nothing else is connecting to it. If you find another port open
other then the web interface, maybe you can configure it in MH and see
if its the correct one.


-Wayne


On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 12:36 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> The reports I have seen on the Hub II (2245-222 I believe) indicate that it
> no loner has the "PLM" feature inside of it.  So it may not work with MH.
>
> But given the comparatively cheap price of $40, I have ordered one to tinker
> with.
>
> Rambling Thoughts:
> I have been toying with the idea of creating a separate Insteon Interface
> that exposes a standardized API for the hubs.  Leave the link management and
> device configuration to the hub but abstract and standardize an interface
> for controlling Insteon devices.
>
> Home automation is getting more fragmented.  There is a need for a good
> central aggregation platform.  MH might be able to fill that role.
>
> Coding our own custom support for each protocol entirely in-house is a
> monstrous task.  The hundreds of hours of Insteon coding in MH can only ever
> be used by MH.  I suspect that we might find more coding assistance and
> interest if we abstracted the Insteon support into a standalone project that
> other aggregating platforms could also use.
>
> Again, just random thoughts.
>
> On Tue, Dec 9, 2014 at 10:36 AM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> I have the INSTEON 2242-222 Hub and it works pretty good.  Have you tried
>> doing a port scan to see if they just changed the port number?  Or maybe
>> there's an option to enable it in the app or Web interface.  I hope they
>> aren't moving away from having the low level tcp interface in the new
>> models,  that would mean we would need to possibly write new code to use the
>> Web api.
>>
>> On Dec 5, 2014 10:50 PM, "peter" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Greetings all,
>>>
>>> I have a usb PLM 2413UH that has been flaky for some time so I am looking
>>> for an
>>> alternative.
>>>
>>> I purchased a Hub 2 2245-222 after a hurried check to verify
>>> compatibility. My
>>> checks were apparently inadequate as further research after the fact
>>> suggests that
>>> it is probably not a viable alternative. I tried to telnet to the Hub IP
>>> at port
>>> 9761 and get a could not open port msg. The hub does respond to ping. Is
>>> there any
>>> one out there that has found a way to use the Hub 2 as a substitute for a
>>> PLM? I
>>> would rather not purchase another 2413UH as they are, in my opinion,
>>> overpriced,
>>> less reliable than they ought to be and don't have an ethernet interface.
>>> I also
>>> don't want to purchase a 'solution' that is no longer in production such
>>> as the
>>> refurb hubs.
>>>
>>> Thanks for taking the time to read and (I hope) respond.
>>>
>>> Peter
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
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>>> ________________________________________________________
>>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
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>> ________________________________________________________
>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
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>>
>>
>

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Re: insteon interface options - Hub 2?

peter-469
Thanks for the report Kevin. I was just about to post the results of the scan I
did when I saw your post. It was far more helpful.

Your assessment that this is essentially an 2414N isn't all bad. For the producers
of the device with access to the code - it still can be assumed to be trivial for
them to produce a new binary (discussed earlier) that restores access through a
selected port and allows us to use MH with Insteon products as 'we' have been. As
I see it, we can have at least the hope of in-production hardware that can help
keep MH viable. So, I guess it is bad news in the short term but I will still hold
out hope.

The web page is beta and so is the Android app. I think it would be reasonable to
expect that while the software is in beta we have a better chance of getting this
change made. I think it worthwhile for us as a community to at least attempt to
influence the Insteon folks to throw us a (binary)bone. If there is agreement, how
ought we to proceed?

Has anyone had a look inside the hub or the 2414N? Is Insteon simply re-working
the boxes to deal with part obsolescence and cost issues?

Peter

On 12/13/2014 12:31 AM, Kevin Robert Keegan wrote:

> The Hub II is not looking good for MH.  The following is a lot of technical rambling.
>
> I opened the device up.  Much of the weight are two steel bars added to make it
> seem more substantial.  Inside it has a PIC32MX695F512H microcontroller with 512K
> of flash and 128K of RAM.  So not much.
>
> I ran NMAP:
>
> Starting Nmap 6.40 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2014-12-12 18:32 PST
> Nmap scan report for 192.168.100.203
> Host is up (0.00074s latency).
> Not shown: 65531 filtered ports
> PORT      STATE SERVICE
> 23/tcp    open  telnet
> 443/tcp   open  https
> 992/tcp   open  telnets
> 25105/tcp open  unknown
>
> The telnet port seems to be available for only a limited time after bootup.  It
> displays a demo screen for the microcontroller, somewhat interesting to look at,
> but best I can tell it doesn't do much.
>
> I couldn't get into the SSL/telnet connection, but I imagine it is the same.
>
> both the 443 and 25105 port are http servers that respond with the same simple
> page describing the details of the Hub and instructions on how to find the user
> manual and instructions to visit:
>
> connect.insteon.com <https://connect.insteon.com/>
>
> to control the hub.
>
> If you poke around you can also get to a MPFS Image Upload page.  This appears to
> allow uploading of new microcontroller binary files.  So there is an outside
> chance we could upload our own, but in doing so we would almost certainly break
> the original functionality of the hub since we would be wiping out the original
> binary image.
>
>
> The connect website is seriously lacking in comparison to the iOS and Android
> apps.  Best I can tell it actually tries to communicate directly with your hub's
> local private IP address to issue commands, so the website (if it worked) would
> only be usable in your own house.  I see a career posting on Insteon's website for
> a web programmer, so maybe this is under development.
>
> I did some packet sniffing of the hub.  It seems to connect and keep-alive SSL
> connections to connect.insteon.com <http://connect.insteon.com> and
> prod.insteon.pubnub.com <http://prod.insteon.pubnub.com>.  If I had to guess, I
> would say that the messages from the Hub to the mobile devices go out across the
> pubnub connection and commands issued from the phone are sent to the insteon website.
>
> I had hoped that given the diminutive nature of the device that it wouldn't verify
> the accuracy of SSL certificates.  I tried remapping these addresses to my own SSL
> server, but the device seemed to fail to complete the SSL handshake.  I did not
> try self-signing a certificate as one of the two services.  It is possible that
> the device doesn't have information on the root certificates.
>
> The hub still seems to communicate using the same method described here:
>
> http://www.leftovercode.info/smartlinc.html
>
> For most purposes, the hub seems to simply act as a TCP PLM (almost quite
> literally, the simple webpage lists a separate firmware number for the PLM).  So
> the PLM electronics have likely just been adapted to interface with the
> microcontroller.  It looks like all of the logic is handled by the various mobile
> apps and perhaps the connect webservice.  I would guess that the hub simply
> receives prewritten insteon messages and transmits them.  This way the firmware
> doesn't need to be updated everytime a new device is added to the Insteon lineup.
>
> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:41 AM, Peter Whalley <[hidden email]
> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>
>     Thanks for your comments Wayne.
>
>     As far our remarks regarding the external site go, Wouldn't that depend at
>     least on whether or not you are connecting via LAN vs WAN? I know nothing
>     about the way the Hub II works in terms of where and how the code lives and
>     works. For a WAN connection, I would expect this to start with the app
>     initially connecting to the insteon authentication portal which will provide
>     redirection information (a handoff) after authentication. This would require
>     regular checkins by Hub II to keep WAN IP up to date (unless Hub can check the
>     WAN IP on it's own). Having the Hub keep track would seem best but this is all
>     speculation on my part. As I think about it, there would need to be some keys
>     exchanged to secure the process after handoff etc. as well.
>
>     I assume that the nmap example was not on a Hub II correct? I will be happy to
>     do the scan and publish the results - if possible I will post them tonight.
>     Esp if it is not duplication of effort.
>
>     At the moment I do not have MH up and running so I would rather rely on a
>     simpler faster method of testing what can be done with any open ports found.
>     I have been toying with MH on recycled desktops but that has turned out to be
>     less reliable and more complicated to implement than I want to count on for
>     anything more than curiosity. Most recently, I have had issues with
>     intermittent 2413 USB interface that killed progress. I purchased the HUB II
>     and a BeagleBone last month in hopes of getting a reliable platform for MH
>     that I could afford to have spares on hand for in case of failure. I also
>     dont' like the lack of a positive retention feature on USB which is yet
>     another reason to avoid another 2413U.
>
>     I was planning on working to get the BBB running MH this weekend depending on
>     'chores',etc. Even if I get it done, I would be less than confident using it
>     for testing the Hub II but perhaps setup will go smoothly and I will find a
>     port worth poking at! Would still prefer to use terminal and 'poke' that way
>     though...
>
>     Regards,
>
>     Peter
>
>     On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 12:38 PM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]
>     <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>
>         Sorry for the very late response, my new baby girl (7 days old) had to
>         be admitted to the hospital, so I've been there all week.
>
>         Kevin,
>
>         I agree, I've been thinking about the hub web API instead of the raw
>         Insteon protocol and that would push individual Insteon device support
>         back to the HUB. This also may allow for devices/scenes to be added
>         via misterhouse and then automatically discovered by the Insteon
>         Android app, so you don't have to add them in both places. The only
>         down side I see to using the web API is that we will probably lose
>         some of the the features like fast on and broadcast.
>
>
>         Peter,
>
>         I agree, removing the direct Insteon interface makes no sense. The
>         biggest issue I find with most everything I purchase is that the
>         manufacturer tries to force you to use their products exclusively,
>         they way they want you to use them. I especially hate when you are
>         forced to use a "cloud" service outside of your home network, I do not
>         want to rely on my home internet service to be able to turn my lights
>         on...
>
>         The external site you are referring to, is just another way to control
>         the devices connected to the HUB, I'm not sure exactly what else it
>         does but I'll do some network captures this week and see. I know the
>         Android app connects direct to the HUB (as would MH), it does not rely
>         on the external site to send commands to Insteon devices.
>
>
>         If you still want to do the scans, you can use nmap:
>
>         nmap 192.168.1.30 -p 1-65535 --open
>
>         Starting Nmap 6.40 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2014-12-12 10:54 CST
>         Nmap scan report for 192.168.195.30
>         Host is up (0.0043s latency).
>         Not shown: 10 filtered ports
>         PORT     STATE SERVICE
>         80/tcp   open  http
>         9761/tcp open  unknown
>         MAC Address: 00:0E:F3:26:15:30 (Smarthome)
>
>
>         Only 1 connection to the Insteon interface port is allowed, so make
>         sure nothing else is connecting to it. If you find another port open
>         other then the web interface, maybe you can configure it in MH and see
>         if its the correct one.
>
>
>         -Wayne
>
>
>         On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 12:36 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan
>         <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>         > The reports I have seen on the Hub II (2245-222 I believe) indicate that it
>         > no loner has the "PLM" feature inside of it.  So it may not work with MH.
>         >
>         > But given the comparatively cheap price of $40, I have ordered one to tinker
>         > with.
>         >
>         > Rambling Thoughts:
>         > I have been toying with the idea of creating a separate Insteon Interface
>         > that exposes a standardized API for the hubs.  Leave the link management and
>         > device configuration to the hub but abstract and standardize an interface
>         > for controlling Insteon devices.
>         >
>         > Home automation is getting more fragmented.  There is a need for a good
>         > central aggregation platform.  MH might be able to fill that role.
>         >
>         > Coding our own custom support for each protocol entirely in-house is a
>         > monstrous task.  The hundreds of hours of Insteon coding in MH can only ever
>         > be used by MH.  I suspect that we might find more coding assistance and
>         > interest if we abstracted the Insteon support into a standalone project that
>         > other aggregating platforms could also use.
>         >
>         > Again, just random thoughts.
>         >
>         > On Tue, Dec 9, 2014 at 10:36 AM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>         >>
>         >> I have the INSTEON 2242-222 Hub and it works pretty good.  Have you tried
>         >> doing a port scan to see if they just changed the port number?  Or maybe
>         >> there's an option to enable it in the app or Web interface.  I hope they
>         >> aren't moving away from having the low level tcp interface in the new
>         >> models,  that would mean we would need to possibly write new code to use the
>         >> Web api.
>         >>
>         >> On Dec 5, 2014 10:50 PM, "peter" <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>         >>>
>         >>> Greetings all,
>         >>>
>         >>> I have a usb PLM 2413UH that has been flaky for some time so I am looking
>         >>> for an
>         >>> alternative.
>         >>>
>         >>> I purchased a Hub 2 2245-222 after a hurried check to verify
>         >>> compatibility. My
>         >>> checks were apparently inadequate as further research after the fact
>         >>> suggests that
>         >>> it is probably not a viable alternative. I tried to telnet to the Hub IP
>         >>> at port
>         >>> 9761 and get a could not open port msg. The hub does respond to ping. Is
>         >>> there any
>         >>> one out there that has found a way to use the Hub 2 as a substitute for a
>         >>> PLM? I
>         >>> would rather not purchase another 2413UH as they are, in my opinion,
>         >>> overpriced,
>         >>> less reliable than they ought to be and don't have an ethernet interface.
>         >>> I also
>         >>> don't want to purchase a 'solution' that is no longer in production such
>         >>> as the
>         >>> refurb hubs.
>         >>>
>         >>> Thanks for taking the time to read and (I hope) respond.
>         >>>
>         >>> Peter
>         >>>
>         >>>
>         >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>         >>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>         >>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>         >>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>         >>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
>         >>>
>         >>>http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>         >>> ________________________________________________________
>         >>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>         >>>https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>         >>>
>         >>
>         >>
>         >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>         >> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>         >> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>         >> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>         >> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
>         >>
>         >>http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>         >> ________________________________________________________
>         >> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>         >>https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>         >>
>         >>
>         >
>
>
>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>     Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>     from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>     with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>     Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
>     http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>     ________________________________________________________
>     To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>     https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>
>
>

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Re: insteon interface options - Hub 2?

Wayne Gatlin
In reply to this post by krkeegan
I did some captures of the Android app and it sends commands directly
to the Hub, not through the external Insteon site. From what I can
tell, all the devices you add to the app are stored on the external
site (connect.insteon.com) because when the app is initially loaded,
it connects to connect.insteon.com and loads your device list and when
I turn a switch on, it sends the command directly to the internal IP
of the HUB. One reason the HUB connects to the connect.insteon.com
site is to keep up with your external IP and provide it to the
Android/IOS app, this is so you can open the HUB http port to the
Internet and you can control devices from the app outside of your home
network.



-Wayne

On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:31 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> The Hub II is not looking good for MH.  The following is a lot of technical
> rambling.
>
> I opened the device up.  Much of the weight are two steel bars added to make
> it seem more substantial.  Inside it has a PIC32MX695F512H microcontroller
> with 512K of flash and 128K of RAM.  So not much.
>
> I ran NMAP:
>
> Starting Nmap 6.40 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2014-12-12 18:32 PST
> Nmap scan report for 192.168.100.203
> Host is up (0.00074s latency).
> Not shown: 65531 filtered ports
> PORT      STATE SERVICE
> 23/tcp    open  telnet
> 443/tcp   open  https
> 992/tcp   open  telnets
> 25105/tcp open  unknown
>
> The telnet port seems to be available for only a limited time after bootup.
> It displays a demo screen for the microcontroller, somewhat interesting to
> look at, but best I can tell it doesn't do much.
>
> I couldn't get into the SSL/telnet connection, but I imagine it is the same.
>
> both the 443 and 25105 port are http servers that respond with the same
> simple page describing the details of the Hub and instructions on how to
> find the user manual and instructions to visit:
>
> connect.insteon.com
>
> to control the hub.
>
> If you poke around you can also get to a MPFS Image Upload page.  This
> appears to allow uploading of new microcontroller binary files.  So there is
> an outside chance we could upload our own, but in doing so we would almost
> certainly break the original functionality of the hub since we would be
> wiping out the original binary image.
>
>
> The connect website is seriously lacking in comparison to the iOS and
> Android apps.  Best I can tell it actually tries to communicate directly
> with your hub's local private IP address to issue commands, so the website
> (if it worked) would only be usable in your own house.  I see a career
> posting on Insteon's website for a web programmer, so maybe this is under
> development.
>
> I did some packet sniffing of the hub.  It seems to connect and keep-alive
> SSL connections to connect.insteon.com and prod.insteon.pubnub.com.  If I
> had to guess, I would say that the messages from the Hub to the mobile
> devices go out across the pubnub connection and commands issued from the
> phone are sent to the insteon website.
>
> I had hoped that given the diminutive nature of the device that it wouldn't
> verify the accuracy of SSL certificates.  I tried remapping these addresses
> to my own SSL server, but the device seemed to fail to complete the SSL
> handshake.  I did not try self-signing a certificate as one of the two
> services.  It is possible that the device doesn't have information on the
> root certificates.
>
> The hub still seems to communicate using the same method described here:
>
> http://www.leftovercode.info/smartlinc.html
>
> For most purposes, the hub seems to simply act as a TCP PLM (almost quite
> literally, the simple webpage lists a separate firmware number for the PLM).
> So the PLM electronics have likely just been adapted to interface with the
> microcontroller.  It looks like all of the logic is handled by the various
> mobile apps and perhaps the connect webservice.  I would guess that the hub
> simply receives prewritten insteon messages and transmits them.  This way
> the firmware doesn't need to be updated everytime a new device is added to
> the Insteon lineup.
>
> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:41 AM, Peter Whalley <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>>
>> Thanks for your comments Wayne.
>>
>> As far our remarks regarding the external site go, Wouldn't that depend at
>> least on whether or not you are connecting via LAN vs WAN? I know nothing
>> about the way the Hub II works in terms of where and how the code lives and
>> works. For a WAN connection, I would expect this to start with the app
>> initially connecting to the insteon authentication portal which will provide
>> redirection information (a handoff) after authentication. This would require
>> regular checkins by Hub II to keep WAN IP up to date (unless Hub can check
>> the WAN IP on it's own). Having the Hub keep track would seem best but this
>> is all speculation on my part. As I think about it, there would need to be
>> some keys exchanged to secure the process after handoff etc. as well.
>>
>> I assume that the nmap example was not on a Hub II correct? I will be
>> happy to do the scan and publish the results - if possible I will post them
>> tonight. Esp if it is not duplication of effort.
>>
>> At the moment I do not have MH up and running so I would rather rely on a
>> simpler faster method of testing what can be done with any open ports found.
>> I have been toying with MH on recycled desktops but that has turned out to
>> be less reliable and more complicated to implement than I want to count on
>> for anything more than curiosity. Most recently, I have had issues with
>> intermittent 2413 USB interface that killed progress. I purchased the HUB II
>> and a BeagleBone last month in hopes of getting a reliable platform for MH
>> that I could afford to have spares on hand for in case of failure. I also
>> dont' like the lack of a positive retention feature on USB which is yet
>> another reason to avoid another 2413U.
>>
>> I was planning on working to get the BBB running MH this weekend depending
>> on 'chores',etc. Even if I get it done, I would be less than confident using
>> it for testing the Hub II but perhaps setup will go smoothly and I will find
>> a port worth poking at! Would still prefer to use terminal and 'poke' that
>> way though...
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Peter
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 12:38 PM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> Sorry for the very late response, my new baby girl (7 days old) had to
>>> be admitted to the hospital, so I've been there all week.
>>>
>>> Kevin,
>>>
>>> I agree, I've been thinking about the hub web API instead of the raw
>>> Insteon protocol and that would push individual Insteon device support
>>> back to the HUB. This also may allow for devices/scenes to be added
>>> via misterhouse and then automatically discovered by the Insteon
>>> Android app, so you don't have to add them in both places. The only
>>> down side I see to using the web API is that we will probably lose
>>> some of the the features like fast on and broadcast.
>>>
>>>
>>> Peter,
>>>
>>> I agree, removing the direct Insteon interface makes no sense. The
>>> biggest issue I find with most everything I purchase is that the
>>> manufacturer tries to force you to use their products exclusively,
>>> they way they want you to use them. I especially hate when you are
>>> forced to use a "cloud" service outside of your home network, I do not
>>> want to rely on my home internet service to be able to turn my lights
>>> on...
>>>
>>> The external site you are referring to, is just another way to control
>>> the devices connected to the HUB, I'm not sure exactly what else it
>>> does but I'll do some network captures this week and see. I know the
>>> Android app connects direct to the HUB (as would MH), it does not rely
>>> on the external site to send commands to Insteon devices.
>>>
>>>
>>> If you still want to do the scans, you can use nmap:
>>>
>>> nmap 192.168.1.30 -p 1-65535 --open
>>>
>>> Starting Nmap 6.40 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2014-12-12 10:54 CST
>>> Nmap scan report for 192.168.195.30
>>> Host is up (0.0043s latency).
>>> Not shown: 10 filtered ports
>>> PORT     STATE SERVICE
>>> 80/tcp   open  http
>>> 9761/tcp open  unknown
>>> MAC Address: 00:0E:F3:26:15:30 (Smarthome)
>>>
>>>
>>> Only 1 connection to the Insteon interface port is allowed, so make
>>> sure nothing else is connecting to it. If you find another port open
>>> other then the web interface, maybe you can configure it in MH and see
>>> if its the correct one.
>>>
>>>
>>> -Wayne
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 12:36 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan
>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> > The reports I have seen on the Hub II (2245-222 I believe) indicate
>>> > that it
>>> > no loner has the "PLM" feature inside of it.  So it may not work with
>>> > MH.
>>> >
>>> > But given the comparatively cheap price of $40, I have ordered one to
>>> > tinker
>>> > with.
>>> >
>>> > Rambling Thoughts:
>>> > I have been toying with the idea of creating a separate Insteon
>>> > Interface
>>> > that exposes a standardized API for the hubs.  Leave the link
>>> > management and
>>> > device configuration to the hub but abstract and standardize an
>>> > interface
>>> > for controlling Insteon devices.
>>> >
>>> > Home automation is getting more fragmented.  There is a need for a good
>>> > central aggregation platform.  MH might be able to fill that role.
>>> >
>>> > Coding our own custom support for each protocol entirely in-house is a
>>> > monstrous task.  The hundreds of hours of Insteon coding in MH can only
>>> > ever
>>> > be used by MH.  I suspect that we might find more coding assistance and
>>> > interest if we abstracted the Insteon support into a standalone project
>>> > that
>>> > other aggregating platforms could also use.
>>> >
>>> > Again, just random thoughts.
>>> >
>>> > On Tue, Dec 9, 2014 at 10:36 AM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]>
>>> > wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> I have the INSTEON 2242-222 Hub and it works pretty good.  Have you
>>> >> tried
>>> >> doing a port scan to see if they just changed the port number?  Or
>>> >> maybe
>>> >> there's an option to enable it in the app or Web interface.  I hope
>>> >> they
>>> >> aren't moving away from having the low level tcp interface in the new
>>> >> models,  that would mean we would need to possibly write new code to
>>> >> use the
>>> >> Web api.
>>> >>
>>> >> On Dec 5, 2014 10:50 PM, "peter" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Greetings all,
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I have a usb PLM 2413UH that has been flaky for some time so I am
>>> >>> looking
>>> >>> for an
>>> >>> alternative.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I purchased a Hub 2 2245-222 after a hurried check to verify
>>> >>> compatibility. My
>>> >>> checks were apparently inadequate as further research after the fact
>>> >>> suggests that
>>> >>> it is probably not a viable alternative. I tried to telnet to the Hub
>>> >>> IP
>>> >>> at port
>>> >>> 9761 and get a could not open port msg. The hub does respond to ping.
>>> >>> Is
>>> >>> there any
>>> >>> one out there that has found a way to use the Hub 2 as a substitute
>>> >>> for a
>>> >>> PLM? I
>>> >>> would rather not purchase another 2413UH as they are, in my opinion,
>>> >>> overpriced,
>>> >>> less reliable than they ought to be and don't have an ethernet
>>> >>> interface.
>>> >>> I also
>>> >>> don't want to purchase a 'solution' that is no longer in production
>>> >>> such
>>> >>> as the
>>> >>> refurb hubs.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Thanks for taking the time to read and (I hope) respond.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Peter
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> >>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>>> >>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and
>>> >>> Dashboards
>>> >>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration &
>>> >>> more
>>> >>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations,
>>> >>> FREE
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>>> >>> ________________________________________________________
>>> >>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>>> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>> >>>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> >> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>>> >> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and
>>> >> Dashboards
>>> >> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration &
>>> >> more
>>> >> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations,
>>> >> FREE
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>>> >> ________________________________________________________
>>> >> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>>> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
>>
>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>> ________________________________________________________
>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
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> ________________________________________________________
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>
>

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Re: insteon interface options - Hub 2?

Wayne Gatlin
Have you guys tried sending some http commands to the HUB 2?


Do theses work?

Replace <INSTEONID> with the device ID and 192.168.1.30:80 with the
HUB IP:port (IE: curl
http://hubuser:hubpassword@192.168.1.30:80/3?02622FFD890F11FF=I=3)

curl http://hubuser:hubpassword@192.168.1.30/3?0262<INSTEONID>0F11FF=I=3
curl http://hubuser:hubpassword@192.168.1.30/3?0262<INSTEONID>0F13FF=I=3


These do work with the 2242.


-Wayne

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 7:09 PM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I did some captures of the Android app and it sends commands directly
> to the Hub, not through the external Insteon site. From what I can
> tell, all the devices you add to the app are stored on the external
> site (connect.insteon.com) because when the app is initially loaded,
> it connects to connect.insteon.com and loads your device list and when
> I turn a switch on, it sends the command directly to the internal IP
> of the HUB. One reason the HUB connects to the connect.insteon.com
> site is to keep up with your external IP and provide it to the
> Android/IOS app, this is so you can open the HUB http port to the
> Internet and you can control devices from the app outside of your home
> network.
>
>
>
> -Wayne
>
> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:31 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> The Hub II is not looking good for MH.  The following is a lot of technical
>> rambling.
>>
>> I opened the device up.  Much of the weight are two steel bars added to make
>> it seem more substantial.  Inside it has a PIC32MX695F512H microcontroller
>> with 512K of flash and 128K of RAM.  So not much.
>>
>> I ran NMAP:
>>
>> Starting Nmap 6.40 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2014-12-12 18:32 PST
>> Nmap scan report for 192.168.100.203
>> Host is up (0.00074s latency).
>> Not shown: 65531 filtered ports
>> PORT      STATE SERVICE
>> 23/tcp    open  telnet
>> 443/tcp   open  https
>> 992/tcp   open  telnets
>> 25105/tcp open  unknown
>>
>> The telnet port seems to be available for only a limited time after bootup.
>> It displays a demo screen for the microcontroller, somewhat interesting to
>> look at, but best I can tell it doesn't do much.
>>
>> I couldn't get into the SSL/telnet connection, but I imagine it is the same.
>>
>> both the 443 and 25105 port are http servers that respond with the same
>> simple page describing the details of the Hub and instructions on how to
>> find the user manual and instructions to visit:
>>
>> connect.insteon.com
>>
>> to control the hub.
>>
>> If you poke around you can also get to a MPFS Image Upload page.  This
>> appears to allow uploading of new microcontroller binary files.  So there is
>> an outside chance we could upload our own, but in doing so we would almost
>> certainly break the original functionality of the hub since we would be
>> wiping out the original binary image.
>>
>>
>> The connect website is seriously lacking in comparison to the iOS and
>> Android apps.  Best I can tell it actually tries to communicate directly
>> with your hub's local private IP address to issue commands, so the website
>> (if it worked) would only be usable in your own house.  I see a career
>> posting on Insteon's website for a web programmer, so maybe this is under
>> development.
>>
>> I did some packet sniffing of the hub.  It seems to connect and keep-alive
>> SSL connections to connect.insteon.com and prod.insteon.pubnub.com.  If I
>> had to guess, I would say that the messages from the Hub to the mobile
>> devices go out across the pubnub connection and commands issued from the
>> phone are sent to the insteon website.
>>
>> I had hoped that given the diminutive nature of the device that it wouldn't
>> verify the accuracy of SSL certificates.  I tried remapping these addresses
>> to my own SSL server, but the device seemed to fail to complete the SSL
>> handshake.  I did not try self-signing a certificate as one of the two
>> services.  It is possible that the device doesn't have information on the
>> root certificates.
>>
>> The hub still seems to communicate using the same method described here:
>>
>> http://www.leftovercode.info/smartlinc.html
>>
>> For most purposes, the hub seems to simply act as a TCP PLM (almost quite
>> literally, the simple webpage lists a separate firmware number for the PLM).
>> So the PLM electronics have likely just been adapted to interface with the
>> microcontroller.  It looks like all of the logic is handled by the various
>> mobile apps and perhaps the connect webservice.  I would guess that the hub
>> simply receives prewritten insteon messages and transmits them.  This way
>> the firmware doesn't need to be updated everytime a new device is added to
>> the Insteon lineup.
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:41 AM, Peter Whalley <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Thanks for your comments Wayne.
>>>
>>> As far our remarks regarding the external site go, Wouldn't that depend at
>>> least on whether or not you are connecting via LAN vs WAN? I know nothing
>>> about the way the Hub II works in terms of where and how the code lives and
>>> works. For a WAN connection, I would expect this to start with the app
>>> initially connecting to the insteon authentication portal which will provide
>>> redirection information (a handoff) after authentication. This would require
>>> regular checkins by Hub II to keep WAN IP up to date (unless Hub can check
>>> the WAN IP on it's own). Having the Hub keep track would seem best but this
>>> is all speculation on my part. As I think about it, there would need to be
>>> some keys exchanged to secure the process after handoff etc. as well.
>>>
>>> I assume that the nmap example was not on a Hub II correct? I will be
>>> happy to do the scan and publish the results - if possible I will post them
>>> tonight. Esp if it is not duplication of effort.
>>>
>>> At the moment I do not have MH up and running so I would rather rely on a
>>> simpler faster method of testing what can be done with any open ports found.
>>> I have been toying with MH on recycled desktops but that has turned out to
>>> be less reliable and more complicated to implement than I want to count on
>>> for anything more than curiosity. Most recently, I have had issues with
>>> intermittent 2413 USB interface that killed progress. I purchased the HUB II
>>> and a BeagleBone last month in hopes of getting a reliable platform for MH
>>> that I could afford to have spares on hand for in case of failure. I also
>>> dont' like the lack of a positive retention feature on USB which is yet
>>> another reason to avoid another 2413U.
>>>
>>> I was planning on working to get the BBB running MH this weekend depending
>>> on 'chores',etc. Even if I get it done, I would be less than confident using
>>> it for testing the Hub II but perhaps setup will go smoothly and I will find
>>> a port worth poking at! Would still prefer to use terminal and 'poke' that
>>> way though...
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Peter
>>>
>>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 12:38 PM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Sorry for the very late response, my new baby girl (7 days old) had to
>>>> be admitted to the hospital, so I've been there all week.
>>>>
>>>> Kevin,
>>>>
>>>> I agree, I've been thinking about the hub web API instead of the raw
>>>> Insteon protocol and that would push individual Insteon device support
>>>> back to the HUB. This also may allow for devices/scenes to be added
>>>> via misterhouse and then automatically discovered by the Insteon
>>>> Android app, so you don't have to add them in both places. The only
>>>> down side I see to using the web API is that we will probably lose
>>>> some of the the features like fast on and broadcast.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Peter,
>>>>
>>>> I agree, removing the direct Insteon interface makes no sense. The
>>>> biggest issue I find with most everything I purchase is that the
>>>> manufacturer tries to force you to use their products exclusively,
>>>> they way they want you to use them. I especially hate when you are
>>>> forced to use a "cloud" service outside of your home network, I do not
>>>> want to rely on my home internet service to be able to turn my lights
>>>> on...
>>>>
>>>> The external site you are referring to, is just another way to control
>>>> the devices connected to the HUB, I'm not sure exactly what else it
>>>> does but I'll do some network captures this week and see. I know the
>>>> Android app connects direct to the HUB (as would MH), it does not rely
>>>> on the external site to send commands to Insteon devices.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> If you still want to do the scans, you can use nmap:
>>>>
>>>> nmap 192.168.1.30 -p 1-65535 --open
>>>>
>>>> Starting Nmap 6.40 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2014-12-12 10:54 CST
>>>> Nmap scan report for 192.168.195.30
>>>> Host is up (0.0043s latency).
>>>> Not shown: 10 filtered ports
>>>> PORT     STATE SERVICE
>>>> 80/tcp   open  http
>>>> 9761/tcp open  unknown
>>>> MAC Address: 00:0E:F3:26:15:30 (Smarthome)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Only 1 connection to the Insteon interface port is allowed, so make
>>>> sure nothing else is connecting to it. If you find another port open
>>>> other then the web interface, maybe you can configure it in MH and see
>>>> if its the correct one.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -Wayne
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 12:36 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan
>>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>> > The reports I have seen on the Hub II (2245-222 I believe) indicate
>>>> > that it
>>>> > no loner has the "PLM" feature inside of it.  So it may not work with
>>>> > MH.
>>>> >
>>>> > But given the comparatively cheap price of $40, I have ordered one to
>>>> > tinker
>>>> > with.
>>>> >
>>>> > Rambling Thoughts:
>>>> > I have been toying with the idea of creating a separate Insteon
>>>> > Interface
>>>> > that exposes a standardized API for the hubs.  Leave the link
>>>> > management and
>>>> > device configuration to the hub but abstract and standardize an
>>>> > interface
>>>> > for controlling Insteon devices.
>>>> >
>>>> > Home automation is getting more fragmented.  There is a need for a good
>>>> > central aggregation platform.  MH might be able to fill that role.
>>>> >
>>>> > Coding our own custom support for each protocol entirely in-house is a
>>>> > monstrous task.  The hundreds of hours of Insteon coding in MH can only
>>>> > ever
>>>> > be used by MH.  I suspect that we might find more coding assistance and
>>>> > interest if we abstracted the Insteon support into a standalone project
>>>> > that
>>>> > other aggregating platforms could also use.
>>>> >
>>>> > Again, just random thoughts.
>>>> >
>>>> > On Tue, Dec 9, 2014 at 10:36 AM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]>
>>>> > wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I have the INSTEON 2242-222 Hub and it works pretty good.  Have you
>>>> >> tried
>>>> >> doing a port scan to see if they just changed the port number?  Or
>>>> >> maybe
>>>> >> there's an option to enable it in the app or Web interface.  I hope
>>>> >> they
>>>> >> aren't moving away from having the low level tcp interface in the new
>>>> >> models,  that would mean we would need to possibly write new code to
>>>> >> use the
>>>> >> Web api.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On Dec 5, 2014 10:50 PM, "peter" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Greetings all,
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I have a usb PLM 2413UH that has been flaky for some time so I am
>>>> >>> looking
>>>> >>> for an
>>>> >>> alternative.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I purchased a Hub 2 2245-222 after a hurried check to verify
>>>> >>> compatibility. My
>>>> >>> checks were apparently inadequate as further research after the fact
>>>> >>> suggests that
>>>> >>> it is probably not a viable alternative. I tried to telnet to the Hub
>>>> >>> IP
>>>> >>> at port
>>>> >>> 9761 and get a could not open port msg. The hub does respond to ping.
>>>> >>> Is
>>>> >>> there any
>>>> >>> one out there that has found a way to use the Hub 2 as a substitute
>>>> >>> for a
>>>> >>> PLM? I
>>>> >>> would rather not purchase another 2413UH as they are, in my opinion,
>>>> >>> overpriced,
>>>> >>> less reliable than they ought to be and don't have an ethernet
>>>> >>> interface.
>>>> >>> I also
>>>> >>> don't want to purchase a 'solution' that is no longer in production
>>>> >>> such
>>>> >>> as the
>>>> >>> refurb hubs.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Thanks for taking the time to read and (I hope) respond.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Peter
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> >>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>>>> >>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and
>>>> >>> Dashboards
>>>> >>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration &
>>>> >>> more
>>>> >>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations,
>>>> >>> FREE
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>>>> >>> ________________________________________________________
>>>> >>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>>>> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> >> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>>>> >> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and
>>>> >> Dashboards
>>>> >> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration &
>>>> >> more
>>>> >> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations,
>>>> >> FREE
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>>>> >> ________________________________________________________
>>>> >> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>>>> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
>>>
>>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>>> ________________________________________________________
>>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>> ________________________________________________________
>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>
>>

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
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Re: insteon interface options - Hub 2?

krkeegan
Administrator
Yes, commands like that will still work with the HUB2.

On Sat, Dec 20, 2014 at 1:44 PM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]> wrote:
Have you guys tried sending some http commands to the HUB 2?


Do theses work?

Replace <INSTEONID> with the device ID and 192.168.1.30:80 with the
HUB IP:port (IE: curl
http://hubuser:hubpassword@192.168.1.30:80/3?02622FFD890F11FF=I=3)

curl http://hubuser:hubpassword@192.168.1.30/3?0262<INSTEONID>0F11FF=I=3
curl http://hubuser:hubpassword@192.168.1.30/3?0262<INSTEONID>0F13FF=I=3


These do work with the 2242.


-Wayne

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 7:09 PM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I did some captures of the Android app and it sends commands directly
> to the Hub, not through the external Insteon site. From what I can
> tell, all the devices you add to the app are stored on the external
> site (connect.insteon.com) because when the app is initially loaded,
> it connects to connect.insteon.com and loads your device list and when
> I turn a switch on, it sends the command directly to the internal IP
> of the HUB. One reason the HUB connects to the connect.insteon.com
> site is to keep up with your external IP and provide it to the
> Android/IOS app, this is so you can open the HUB http port to the
> Internet and you can control devices from the app outside of your home
> network.
>
>
>
> -Wayne
>
> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:31 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> The Hub II is not looking good for MH.  The following is a lot of technical
>> rambling.
>>
>> I opened the device up.  Much of the weight are two steel bars added to make
>> it seem more substantial.  Inside it has a PIC32MX695F512H microcontroller
>> with 512K of flash and 128K of RAM.  So not much.
>>
>> I ran NMAP:
>>
>> Starting Nmap 6.40 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2014-12-12 18:32 PST
>> Nmap scan report for 192.168.100.203
>> Host is up (0.00074s latency).
>> Not shown: 65531 filtered ports
>> PORT      STATE SERVICE
>> 23/tcp    open  telnet
>> 443/tcp   open  https
>> 992/tcp   open  telnets
>> 25105/tcp open  unknown
>>
>> The telnet port seems to be available for only a limited time after bootup.
>> It displays a demo screen for the microcontroller, somewhat interesting to
>> look at, but best I can tell it doesn't do much.
>>
>> I couldn't get into the SSL/telnet connection, but I imagine it is the same.
>>
>> both the 443 and 25105 port are http servers that respond with the same
>> simple page describing the details of the Hub and instructions on how to
>> find the user manual and instructions to visit:
>>
>> connect.insteon.com
>>
>> to control the hub.
>>
>> If you poke around you can also get to a MPFS Image Upload page.  This
>> appears to allow uploading of new microcontroller binary files.  So there is
>> an outside chance we could upload our own, but in doing so we would almost
>> certainly break the original functionality of the hub since we would be
>> wiping out the original binary image.
>>
>>
>> The connect website is seriously lacking in comparison to the iOS and
>> Android apps.  Best I can tell it actually tries to communicate directly
>> with your hub's local private IP address to issue commands, so the website
>> (if it worked) would only be usable in your own house.  I see a career
>> posting on Insteon's website for a web programmer, so maybe this is under
>> development.
>>
>> I did some packet sniffing of the hub.  It seems to connect and keep-alive
>> SSL connections to connect.insteon.com and prod.insteon.pubnub.com.  If I
>> had to guess, I would say that the messages from the Hub to the mobile
>> devices go out across the pubnub connection and commands issued from the
>> phone are sent to the insteon website.
>>
>> I had hoped that given the diminutive nature of the device that it wouldn't
>> verify the accuracy of SSL certificates.  I tried remapping these addresses
>> to my own SSL server, but the device seemed to fail to complete the SSL
>> handshake.  I did not try self-signing a certificate as one of the two
>> services.  It is possible that the device doesn't have information on the
>> root certificates.
>>
>> The hub still seems to communicate using the same method described here:
>>
>> http://www.leftovercode.info/smartlinc.html
>>
>> For most purposes, the hub seems to simply act as a TCP PLM (almost quite
>> literally, the simple webpage lists a separate firmware number for the PLM).
>> So the PLM electronics have likely just been adapted to interface with the
>> microcontroller.  It looks like all of the logic is handled by the various
>> mobile apps and perhaps the connect webservice.  I would guess that the hub
>> simply receives prewritten insteon messages and transmits them.  This way
>> the firmware doesn't need to be updated everytime a new device is added to
>> the Insteon lineup.
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 11:41 AM, Peter Whalley <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Thanks for your comments Wayne.
>>>
>>> As far our remarks regarding the external site go, Wouldn't that depend at
>>> least on whether or not you are connecting via LAN vs WAN? I know nothing
>>> about the way the Hub II works in terms of where and how the code lives and
>>> works. For a WAN connection, I would expect this to start with the app
>>> initially connecting to the insteon authentication portal which will provide
>>> redirection information (a handoff) after authentication. This would require
>>> regular checkins by Hub II to keep WAN IP up to date (unless Hub can check
>>> the WAN IP on it's own). Having the Hub keep track would seem best but this
>>> is all speculation on my part. As I think about it, there would need to be
>>> some keys exchanged to secure the process after handoff etc. as well.
>>>
>>> I assume that the nmap example was not on a Hub II correct? I will be
>>> happy to do the scan and publish the results - if possible I will post them
>>> tonight. Esp if it is not duplication of effort.
>>>
>>> At the moment I do not have MH up and running so I would rather rely on a
>>> simpler faster method of testing what can be done with any open ports found.
>>> I have been toying with MH on recycled desktops but that has turned out to
>>> be less reliable and more complicated to implement than I want to count on
>>> for anything more than curiosity. Most recently, I have had issues with
>>> intermittent 2413 USB interface that killed progress. I purchased the HUB II
>>> and a BeagleBone last month in hopes of getting a reliable platform for MH
>>> that I could afford to have spares on hand for in case of failure. I also
>>> dont' like the lack of a positive retention feature on USB which is yet
>>> another reason to avoid another 2413U.
>>>
>>> I was planning on working to get the BBB running MH this weekend depending
>>> on 'chores',etc. Even if I get it done, I would be less than confident using
>>> it for testing the Hub II but perhaps setup will go smoothly and I will find
>>> a port worth poking at! Would still prefer to use terminal and 'poke' that
>>> way though...
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Peter
>>>
>>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 12:38 PM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Sorry for the very late response, my new baby girl (7 days old) had to
>>>> be admitted to the hospital, so I've been there all week.
>>>>
>>>> Kevin,
>>>>
>>>> I agree, I've been thinking about the hub web API instead of the raw
>>>> Insteon protocol and that would push individual Insteon device support
>>>> back to the HUB. This also may allow for devices/scenes to be added
>>>> via misterhouse and then automatically discovered by the Insteon
>>>> Android app, so you don't have to add them in both places. The only
>>>> down side I see to using the web API is that we will probably lose
>>>> some of the the features like fast on and broadcast.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Peter,
>>>>
>>>> I agree, removing the direct Insteon interface makes no sense. The
>>>> biggest issue I find with most everything I purchase is that the
>>>> manufacturer tries to force you to use their products exclusively,
>>>> they way they want you to use them. I especially hate when you are
>>>> forced to use a "cloud" service outside of your home network, I do not
>>>> want to rely on my home internet service to be able to turn my lights
>>>> on...
>>>>
>>>> The external site you are referring to, is just another way to control
>>>> the devices connected to the HUB, I'm not sure exactly what else it
>>>> does but I'll do some network captures this week and see. I know the
>>>> Android app connects direct to the HUB (as would MH), it does not rely
>>>> on the external site to send commands to Insteon devices.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> If you still want to do the scans, you can use nmap:
>>>>
>>>> nmap 192.168.1.30 -p 1-65535 --open
>>>>
>>>> Starting Nmap 6.40 ( http://nmap.org ) at 2014-12-12 10:54 CST
>>>> Nmap scan report for 192.168.195.30
>>>> Host is up (0.0043s latency).
>>>> Not shown: 10 filtered ports
>>>> PORT     STATE SERVICE
>>>> 80/tcp   open  http
>>>> 9761/tcp open  unknown
>>>> MAC Address: 00:0E:F3:26:15:30 (Smarthome)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Only 1 connection to the Insteon interface port is allowed, so make
>>>> sure nothing else is connecting to it. If you find another port open
>>>> other then the web interface, maybe you can configure it in MH and see
>>>> if its the correct one.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -Wayne
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Dec 10, 2014 at 12:36 PM, Kevin Robert Keegan
>>>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>> > The reports I have seen on the Hub II (2245-222 I believe) indicate
>>>> > that it
>>>> > no loner has the "PLM" feature inside of it.  So it may not work with
>>>> > MH.
>>>> >
>>>> > But given the comparatively cheap price of $40, I have ordered one to
>>>> > tinker
>>>> > with.
>>>> >
>>>> > Rambling Thoughts:
>>>> > I have been toying with the idea of creating a separate Insteon
>>>> > Interface
>>>> > that exposes a standardized API for the hubs.  Leave the link
>>>> > management and
>>>> > device configuration to the hub but abstract and standardize an
>>>> > interface
>>>> > for controlling Insteon devices.
>>>> >
>>>> > Home automation is getting more fragmented.  There is a need for a good
>>>> > central aggregation platform.  MH might be able to fill that role.
>>>> >
>>>> > Coding our own custom support for each protocol entirely in-house is a
>>>> > monstrous task.  The hundreds of hours of Insteon coding in MH can only
>>>> > ever
>>>> > be used by MH.  I suspect that we might find more coding assistance and
>>>> > interest if we abstracted the Insteon support into a standalone project
>>>> > that
>>>> > other aggregating platforms could also use.
>>>> >
>>>> > Again, just random thoughts.
>>>> >
>>>> > On Tue, Dec 9, 2014 at 10:36 AM, Wayne Gatlin <[hidden email]>
>>>> > wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I have the INSTEON 2242-222 Hub and it works pretty good.  Have you
>>>> >> tried
>>>> >> doing a port scan to see if they just changed the port number?  Or
>>>> >> maybe
>>>> >> there's an option to enable it in the app or Web interface.  I hope
>>>> >> they
>>>> >> aren't moving away from having the low level tcp interface in the new
>>>> >> models,  that would mean we would need to possibly write new code to
>>>> >> use the
>>>> >> Web api.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On Dec 5, 2014 10:50 PM, "peter" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Greetings all,
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I have a usb PLM 2413UH that has been flaky for some time so I am
>>>> >>> looking
>>>> >>> for an
>>>> >>> alternative.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I purchased a Hub 2 2245-222 after a hurried check to verify
>>>> >>> compatibility. My
>>>> >>> checks were apparently inadequate as further research after the fact
>>>> >>> suggests that
>>>> >>> it is probably not a viable alternative. I tried to telnet to the Hub
>>>> >>> IP
>>>> >>> at port
>>>> >>> 9761 and get a could not open port msg. The hub does respond to ping.
>>>> >>> Is
>>>> >>> there any
>>>> >>> one out there that has found a way to use the Hub 2 as a substitute
>>>> >>> for a
>>>> >>> PLM? I
>>>> >>> would rather not purchase another 2413UH as they are, in my opinion,
>>>> >>> overpriced,
>>>> >>> less reliable than they ought to be and don't have an ethernet
>>>> >>> interface.
>>>> >>> I also
>>>> >>> don't want to purchase a 'solution' that is no longer in production
>>>> >>> such
>>>> >>> as the
>>>> >>> refurb hubs.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Thanks for taking the time to read and (I hope) respond.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Peter
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>>>> >>>
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>>>> >>> ________________________________________________________
>>>> >>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>>>> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> >> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>>>> >> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and
>>>> >> Dashboards
>>>> >> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration &
>>>> >> more
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>>>> >> FREE
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>>>> >> ________________________________________________________
>>>> >> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>>>> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
>>>
>>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>>> ________________________________________________________
>>> To unsubscribe from this list, go to:
>>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/misterhouse-users
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Download BIRT iHub F-Type - The Free Enterprise-Grade BIRT Server
>> from Actuate! Instantly Supercharge Your Business Reports and Dashboards
>> with Interactivity, Sharing, Native Excel Exports, App Integration & more
>> Get technology previously reserved for billion-dollar corporations, FREE
>> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=164703151&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk
>> ________________________________________________________
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>>
>>

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